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Journalists turned PR practitioners fail the industry

26 Nov 2008 13:1852 commentsBizLike
Stop hiring journalists as PR officers because most of them fail to perform.
Have you noticed that many journalists who leave the newsroom to become PR officers crawl back to the newsroom before sunrise? You know why? They are pushed by the love of money rather than the passion for PR. That's why. When the going gets tough, they run back to the newsroom. If you were thinking of hiring a journalist for PR job, please save yourself time and money wasting. The reality has proven that those who did PR as a course are far much better equipped to do the job than those who did journalism at collage. Journalists do not stay in PR but PR graduetes do. Where is Tim Modise, the Communications and Marketing Director of the 2010 Local Organising Committee (LOC),now? He is back to broadcasting at SAFM. He failed to perform. There are many others in government, municipalities and business who can't perform. The choice is yours.
Forum created by Simphiwe Ndwandwe
 
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Herman Lategan
Oh Please!-
Simphiwe, you are making sweeping statements. How do you know why Tim Modise left the 2010 Local Organising Committee?

I have a feeling that those 2010 guys are just a bunch of big fat middle-aged men stuffed inside very tight Armani suits, with more ego than talent.

Also, at the risk of sounding petty. Perhaps you should look at your spelling in future. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:00
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/\/\/\/\/\
...-
Journalists leave PR because they are trained to be objective. Promoting an individual or company goes against that training and all that journalism stands for.It's either promote the crap or not. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:10
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Is that so?-
Yeh! right Posted on 1 Dec 2008 15:24
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Re: Oh Please???-
Oh Herman, you're exactly the type of journos turned practitioners that I was mentioning in my previous comment. No substance, probably tunnel-visioned and assumes that somehow your contribution to this industry is positive when in actual fact you're just a glorified copy writer whose assumptions of PR (otherwise known as your talent) only assist when justifying your income or to give you that warm fuzzy feeling inside that thinks you're somehow a specialist.

PS: Feel free to criticize my spelling, it only just proves that you are good proofreader! Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:34
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Re: Well put!!-
Journos turned PR practitioners tend to not comprehend the importance of the PR role in a company and the responsibility that goes with this. I have encountered many journos turned PR practitioners lacking substance and the foresignt to pursue a meaningful, strategic PR campaign and they tend to think it's about sending out emails only. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:06
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Swinger
No so-
Good PRs come either from the industry they serve, learning communication when they join the PR dept or from media, learning the industry when they join a consultancy. The best have always gone into PR as a second instalment of their careers. The ones that slink back have reacted to dishonesty demanded by bad PR. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:08
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Pedant
Attention to detail-
Simphiwe’s argument would be much more convincing if he took the time to check his spelling. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:11
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Iza
No insight-
You should definately learn to spell before letting off steam... Also if journalists moved for the money they would stay in PR. Generally PR pays better than the average newsroom. Posted on 4 Dec 2008 09:59
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H.T.
Ooh, lose out on a lekker PR job to a hack, did you?-
Rule of thumb: hire PR grads to do events, hire journalists to run the account, write and get your clients quoted in media. Why? Most journalists can write, know how newsrooms work and even know when to use "college" and when to use "collage" correctly. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:15
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Hack guy...-
I think you're an idiot. Having worked both on the publishing and PR agency side, I can honestly say that the assumption that all journos are somehow grammatically great or have insight into newsrooms are a real fallacy. I've seen some real dodgy crap that various journos write (with plenty of spelling mistakes).PR involves thinking, to put a journalist in charge of account management is not only foolish (I actually prefer the word 'stupid' in this instance)but it really oversells the journos ability to deliver cos at the end of the day measurable results need to be presented to your client. Journos are great writers, but that don't make them the next Marcus Brewster! Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:12
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Simonsky
hacking it just fine-
Is a graduete a female graduate, perhaps? Posted on 27 Nov 2008 13:40
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Ayeye
Re: Simonsky-
Actually it refers to people who have nothing to contribute to the issue like you. Posted on 1 Dec 2008 15:31
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:)
So true...-
I did my internship at a agency that employed 2 journalist over a period of a year. And the outcome - the one was an alcholic that couldnt cut it in the industry and got fired - and the other a wannebe PR poppie that just cant handle da pressure. I saw it with my own eyes... Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:11
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Re: So true-
Amen brother!I rest my case!! Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:15
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Feza
This is nonsense-
I'm a journalist working for Government Communications right now and i've been wanting to leave since day one. It is horrible, the work is a routine, dry, flat and boring.

Thats why journalists do not last in PR or government jobs. The ill informed bimbo who started this forum, does not know that the reason Tim Modise went back to broadcasting is because he was tired of a routine and the office-bound work.

In PR or government there is no room for new ideas or creativity, you get people like my boss who are insecure and bullies, merely because they feel threatened by the fearless spirit we jounos have. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:20
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Re: Feza is nonsense-
Clearly narrow-minded Feza doesn't even know the difference between PR and working for government.Your whole comment is noted but "is nonsense". Please google Public Relations and educate yourself. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:31
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you are complete nonsese-
I said PR and Government

do you know what AND means?

Get a job, you clearly have nothing or less to do.

Who is this bimbo, let me google "it" and see what i can find about this bitter soul. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:47
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Re:-
"And" is a word that joins two points. When you joint PR with government in your pathetic attempt of a comment, you combined the points. Please google Feza or read. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:56
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PS
Feza Correct-
Hi Feza, I completely agree with you. I recently resigned from Government Communications because of exactly that.

Clearly the person who started this forum has no idea what Government Communication does. Posted on 1 Dec 2008 14:17
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Monsta
Biased opinion, if I've ever seen one!-
Working in the PR industry for over 10 years, I have seen many journos enter the PR space, and doing so very successfully, as I have too seen PR practitioners give the journalistic/media world a try and doing well. It all amounts to experience and what we're made of. My previous positions all helped me get to where I am today, but it does not dictate how well I do today in my current position ... that boils down to the person I am!

In all honesty, these days I seldom walk away inspired when meeting my industry peers, but many a journalist has made me stop and think. Many have inspired me to keep pushing myself, to continuously educate myself and learn, and to think out the box. Sure, most journos come with serious attitude included, but I find it quite entertaining to deal with. There are different ways of earning respect within our industries and everyone deserves that chance. Remember, it takes all kinds of people! Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:32
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Re:-
I can express my indifference of your opinion and how your lifestory would matter if it wasn't so emotional. Is it that time of the month or something for you?? PMS?? Nonetheless, your diplomatic rhetoric may stem from a good place, but I also think that in PR we need quality control and you're rationalizing a lot unequipped ex-journos to carry on with the half-ass jobs they do. A journalist, to a certain degree (depending on the media owner), can represent credibility, but an ex-journalist in PR who still retains a certain degree of credibility, can really stuff up the industry and cause some serious damage to the industry and all PR practitioners. (Not that the some existing PR practitioners are making it any easy with their unethical PR dealings but nothing is worse than an individual with fake intellengence and ideologies of what PR is). I really feel that there is a need to increase screening and thorough training before letting an ex-journo lose with your brand. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:53
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Urban Zulu
Sour Grapes perhaps?-
Isn't the writer (Simphiwe Ndwandwe) a failed publicists who used to be with one public broadcaster? Methinks this is a case of sour grapes. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:35
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Re: Sour Grapes-
Me thinks that your assuming about the author, fake conspiracy theorist. Don't make an ass of u and me (and the rest of us whose reading your opinion). It's so amateur. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:42
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Urban Zulu
Sour Grapes-
why are 'we' protesting so much. What was amatuer was the comment you made in the first place. Save us (and yourself as well) from your uninformed pieces. People like you should be blacklisted from writing in public platforms. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:50
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Re:-
Sorry for hurting your feelings. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:54
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Bukkybil
Fundamental Difference-
I would agree no less with the writer. The critical difference between a PR practitioner and a journalist turned PR practitioner lies in tactical handling of issues. A PR practitioner looks at issue from a win-win situation 'which is very fundamental to the success of any business organisation' while the later appraoches it from a win-lose approach. The implication of this is that sooner or later,the company with such 'win-lose approach'ceases to be an on-going concern. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:38
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graduete :)
Check, check, double check-
Crap, crap, crap. I'm a journo working with a PR Agency and I cannot believe the copy I get from them. They can't spell and they also don't know what makes a good story. We need more journos in the pr industry. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:46
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Re:-
Go to newsrooms, you'll be doubly shocked at some of the stuff experienced journalists write. Thank God for Sub-Editors!! Posted on 27 Nov 2008 16:00
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PR Hack
Merit in both arguments-
I think that both sides of the argument have merit. I am a trained journalist working in PR for a major company and my training has given me a good grounding to provide a service for my company that is both professional and targeted. I don't spam journos with rubbish. A journalist can be a good PR person if their motivation is correct. No PR person can do their client any justice without having a passion for the busines they represent and a good salary shouldn't stand in the way of doing a good job. Ethics should form a huge part of why you get up in the morning and go to work. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:53
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Simphiwe you wrote this crap?-
This is a forum that the honourable Simphiwe wrote recently. You gotta be kidding me.

Independant on Sunday as an Intern
The mainstream English newspapers should be accessible to junior journalists fresh from the desk.
I am finishing my Journalism diploma in 2009 July. I freelance for Isolezwe newspaper in Durbs, write feature articles, do television doccies and have, optionally, a legal background. So I think I am intelligent, focused, deligent and GOOD IN WHAT I DO. I know my story! Just how do I crack into Sunday Times, Mail&Guardian, City Press or Independant on Sunday as an intern? or Do I need to be EDITORIALLY connected? What do you say...? Posted on 27 Nov 2008 14:54
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Urban Zulu
Sour Grapes-
Hallelujah! This confirms what I have just noted: People like Simphiwe should be banned from writing and commenting in public forums. To think that you are "an intern" scares the living daylights out of me. Thank the gods of writing that you are limited to Isolezwe. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:08
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Peter Pum
Simphiwe is another Malema-
Simphiwe do you know what the definiton for the word Malema means?

idiot, stupid ass and that is what we are dealing with today for the sake of my future I hope not tomorrow.

go to Zim adn write for Mugabe, maybe they would appreciate what you saying Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:17
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Simphiwe
Re: Peter Pum-
Peter "Idiot" Pum you are not appearing to be the opposite of what you are calling me. If you were smart enough you would've played the ball instead of a man. Posted on 1 Dec 2008 15:06
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Peter Pum
Shame Simp, do you need a hug?-
Dude, get over yourself. Please you making an ass out of yourself.

Do you need a hug man? Damn, ignorance is bliss. I pity you Posted on 3 Dec 2008 08:43
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Media mogul
Bull!-
If ever there was a sweeping statement.....!
Journo's who have turned to PR, especially those spesialising in media liaison and media management, have a lot to offer the LPR industry - in the way they write for the press, the way they present news to journo's and realising, to the benefit of their PR clients, the what and how of the media industry.

They hae a lot to offer! Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:02
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Peter plum
Simp-
hey what's this argument about? Journo's vs PR people damn no wonder journo's depise PR people or at least some of them, dude I have been in PR for two years and hated the agency vibe. Yes get a PR grad, but also get yourself someone who can write that press release and have it published at the end of the day its about getting the job done and boosting your clients image/reputation. (that's what it is about) get the people who can do it

i wonder why you are acting like a crazed baboon, you are talking about the "fundamentals of PR" what does it stand for?

Simp, get the fundamentals right before you bite the hand that feeds you Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:10
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River
spellcheck-
I hope you are in neither journalism or PR, your spelling needs attention Posted on 27 Nov 2008 15:18
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journo
Go back to collage and learn how to spell-
Go back to "collage" and learn how to spell Posted on 27 Nov 2008 16:04
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Simphiwe
Re:Journo-
You are very sensitive to the issue. I hope it is not what I am thinking. Posted on 1 Dec 2008 15:14
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Journo / PR
Curious Findings-
I can't believe that I am even entering into this discussion, but have just googled SIMPHIWE NDWANDWE in order to ascertain what would qualify this individual to make such innane and ungrounded statements. I came up with not much over and above the many angry (perhaps bitter?) comments posted by said person on various Bizcomm forums. Prognosis: too much free time. I suggest you don't take the bait! Posted on 27 Nov 2008 16:08
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Journo
Spelling, spelling!!-
Oh yeah? If I take a look at your spelling, I fear for your clients. You need a spell in the newsroom, old boy! Journos believe in the truth, not PR fabrication. Posted on 27 Nov 2008 21:46
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Can't get a job so she attacks-
The only reason she is attacking anyone is because she can't get a job. It’s the same xenophobic paranoia that South Africans have about outsiders stealing their jobs.

My tip to you is to stop wasting your time getting angry and spawning malicious forum pieces and concentrate on improving your writing ability. As we all know, degrees don't make writers, experience does. Posted on 28 Nov 2008 09:26
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Simphiwe
Wrong! Wrong!-
You are utterly wrong. Who said I'm a female? Assumptions? Posted on 1 Dec 2008 15:20
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It's not about gender-
It's not about your gender. Clearly you can't even get the point of something you're reading how do you expect to be able to write succinctly? Posted on 3 Dec 2008 07:03
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PR falls under "Sales", reporting does not-
A reporter/journalist can cross to PR providing he has a passion and a feel for sales , for building a brand, etc.
A good journalist/reporter has different instincts.
I am obviously not referring to the average performer


Ernie Posted on 1 Dec 2008 11:26
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Kate
What exactly do you mean?-
I don't agree with the basis of this article - starting with the headline.
It would be impossible for journalism, or a journalist-turned PR writer, to 'fail' an entire industry. The concept of failing an industry is rubbish - industry is motion, it is not an ideal, it is not a person.
If you were to say that a poor piece of PR writing had failed the industry it was meant to serve in one instance, you might be closer to a point... but still wouldn't have one.
Please share what in your experience has so deftly shaped this belief you have. Posted on 1 Dec 2008 17:26
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Wired
Oh..oh..oh Poor Simphiwe-
Someone, please offer the poor child a job, any takers at Daily Sun???? Maybe she can go scouting for stories about some voodoo mixers in the bush or monitor crime calls in the night??? Child, go back to school, learn to spell and think and have coherent thoughts (You do know what "thoughts" means hey! You might just get yourself a job as a tea lady in a real newsroom and work your way up the ladder. This discussion is really inane and we should not be entertaining bitter and twisted kids like these. Go finish your diploma deary. Posted on 1 Dec 2008 23:06
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Jic
Maybe you have a point-
Google this article: "It's about 'telling the story, not making money'" by Reesha Chibba. Posted on 2 Dec 2008 12:53
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disagree - look at rich mkhondo-
I disagree, look where Rich Mkhondo is now, he started at the Citizen, and now he is chief communications officer, replacing Tim Modise, of the 2010 FIFA World Cup Organising Committee South Posted on 2 Dec 2008 13:53
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c
There is some truth in this-
It takes a certain type of person to succeed in the PR industry and I think the type of person who is drawn to journalism is different from the one draw into PR. Journalists know how to tell it like it is - some have better writing styles than others but the focus is the most possible objective story. Where as PR is about see the product you are working on as the answer and writing for that. Journalists are bred to have a critical view and often PR are meant to have blinkered vision for the product. Posted on 3 Dec 2008 09:33
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Ninenine
Maybe maybe not...-
Perhaps Sips has a point. Some of the ex knock-n-drop and magazine type of journalist do not really crack in the PR industry.

However, the best scenarios that I have seen work well is when you form a team of an Account Manager and a Writer, and whilst you are still at it you could include an Event Specialist – especially when you are servicing large accounts.

What I have seen during the more than a decade in this industry is that:

1. Account Managers in most cases are glorified note-takers – very few can write well, if they do they possibly won’t have any creative design skills. Basically they follow the strategy that was written and possibly sold to the client by someone.
2. Event Specialists are mostly just that – very few can think beyond theme/venue/décor/music/food/etc.
3. Writers / Media Specialist are mostly ‘angle seekers’ - but most ex journos tend to forget to put on their PR hat, thus always wanting to write controversial stuff – in the processing arguing with clients (which could cost you a retainer at the end of the day). Yes controversy will get you the coverage, but in Government that could cost you your job.

So all in all Sips went overboard by generalising, but there is a speck of truth in his assertion.

I bet you there are more journalist-turned-PRO than there are PRO-turned-journalist. Why? My assumption is that the heat could possibly be too much, and off course taking too much pressure for peanuts does not make sense.

There you have it, my two Zim dollar’s worth. BTW: please focus on the thoughts and not the grammar and spelling..:) Posted on 3 Dec 2008 09:59
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Arthur C. Van Wyk
Let's take this online-
In 2009 more journos will become needed in PR/Inbound Marketing positions as online marketing undergoes a drastic paradigm shift and become more content-driven than ever before.

As a designer/brand evangelist I can with surety say that the days of bling bling creativity is dying a slow death and marketing is becoming a discipline where opinion will become more influenced by content than anything else, and nobody is better at creating and sniffing out content than journos.

All they'll need to do is adapt to the digital thoughtspace. Posted on 4 Jan 2009 01:15
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